Another Bad Sales Month for GM, Other US Manufacturer Ford :-(
Question:
For January GM Down 2% Ford Down 9% Toyota Up 16% Nissan Up 26% (Mostly from it’s new Titan truck and this on top of being up 60+% earlier!) Haven’t seen the other manufacturer numbers yet. GM execs blame the cold weather. Guess it wasn’t as cold and snowy over at the Nissan and Toyota dealers, huh! The new OnStar car give-away promotion is apparently a flop…dealers report that people come into the dealer to play the game and simply leave…few, if any sales are resulting from the promotion, apparently. GM has released some newly redesigned vehicles, one would think those would bring in some buyers! Perhaps it will turn around (the continued pervasive erosion of market share) as more of them are made available? For those in this forum that are in the market. What will it take for you to consider a new GM vehicle? What does GM need to do to get you to buy? What features, design elements, functions or consumer related policies need to change (if any do) for you to consider a new GM vehicle? Just curious. I’ll abstain from giving my input…most of you know it already! 
But, folks, we all love GM and GM needs our help! Tell them what you want from them! Apparently they don’t have much of a clue of what buyers want!
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>Ford Down 9% > Toyota Up 16%
I was just reading (MT or C&D maybe?) that for the first time Toyota outsold Ford in the car area. >GM has released some newly redesigned vehicles,
including the old Daewoo line up rebadged as both Suzuki and Chevy (Aveo) >For those in this forum that are in the market. What will it take for you to >consider a new GM vehicle?
I assume you mean "in the market for a new car"? In our case I’m seriously looking at the Malibu vs. the new Pontiac G6 (when it comes out for sale) vs. Toy Corrolla or Ford Focus… >What does GM need to do to get you to buy? What >features, design elements, functions or consumer related policies need to >change
What they need is a good product at a fair price. One that won’t bedevil us with trips tot he dealer for minor (or major) warranty work and one that won’t crap out in a major way the day after the warranty is up… Wir welle bleiwe wat mir sin (Letzebuergesch)
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says… > For January > GM Down 2% > Ford Down 9% > Toyota Up 16% > Nissan Up 26% (Mostly from it’s new Titan truck > and this on top of being up 60+% > earlier!)
People that bought a Titan werent in the market for a real truck obviously… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Haven’t seen the other manufacturer numbers yet. > GM execs blame the cold weather. Guess it wasn’t as cold and snowy over at the > Nissan and Toyota dealers, huh! > The new OnStar car give-away promotion is apparently a flop…dealers report > that people come into the dealer to play the game and simply leave…few, if > any sales are resulting from the promotion, apparently. > GM has released some newly redesigned vehicles, one would think those would > bring in some buyers! Perhaps it will turn around (the continued pervasive > erosion of market share) as more of them are made available? > For those in this forum that are in the market. What will it take for you to > consider a new GM vehicle? What does GM need to do to get you to buy? What > features, design elements, functions or consumer related policies need to > change (if any do) for you to consider a new GM vehicle?
I havent even reached 300,000 miles yet so I’m not looking for anything. 
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> For those in this forum that are in the market. What will it take for you to > consider a new GM vehicle? What does GM need to do to get you to buy? What > features, design elements, functions or consumer related policies need to > change (if any do) for you to consider a new GM vehicle? > Just curious. I’ll abstain from giving my input…most of you know it already! > But, folks, we all love GM and GM needs our help! Tell them what you want > from them! Apparently they don’t have much of a clue of what buyers want!
I already mentioned this: – Consolidate their car lines. Cadillac – same. Buick – pretty much the same – graft the top end Pontiacs into it. Pontiac – Vibe, Aveo, and sporty cars. Chevrolet would be all the SUV lines other than Cadillac. Period. Exception – Corvette would be the one car made under the Chevrolet badge. GMC – 100% commercial vehicles. 4500 series and up. By getting rid of half a dozen redundant choices, they would focus the comsumers’ attention on a few simple choices. Toyota is good at this – they have virtually no overlap in their entire line, so there is a choice for everyone. Two dealerships, not four. In the above scenario, you want a SUV? You get a Chevy Yukon or one of the others. Move the new Buick SUV to Chevrolet and keep the same name, for instance. Truck/SUV? One dealership. The Buick/Chevrolet/GMC version of the same vehicle is a waste of resources. Passenger cars? Buick/Pontiac – one dealership as well – all different with no overlap. Lastly – something inexpensive that’s not a Daewoo. The Vibe is selling so well because it’s not a typical GM vewhicle. A decent replacement for the Cavalier would be good, for instance, as the Toyota Echo is cleaning up in the fleet sales.
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> What they need is a good product at a fair price. One that won’t bedevil us > with trips tot he dealer for minor (or major) warranty work and one that won’t > crap out in a major way the day after the warranty is up…
Then get something like the Vibe with the large engine and manual trans. Build quality is better than a typical GM vehicle, and it has plenty of power. Clutch jobs are cheap as well.
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I guess the most important thing they could do to build brand loyalty would be to stand behind their product better. There is a KNOWN defect in the 3.4L, V-6 intake manifold gasket. This is a well known problem, yet there has been no recall and no extended warranty. We have an ‘02 Pontiac Grand Am with this engine and I am worried about this gasket leaking in the future. http://tinyurl.com/3du7v Tom – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> For January > GM Down 2% > Ford Down 9% > Toyota Up 16% > Nissan Up 26% (Mostly from it’s new Titan truck > and this on top of being up 60+% > earlier!) snip> > For those in this forum that are in the market. What will it take for you to > consider a new GM vehicle? What does GM need to do to get you to buy? What > features, design elements, functions or consumer related policies need to > change (if any do) for you to consider a new GM vehicle? > Just curious. I’ll abstain from giving my input…most of you know it already! > But, folks, we all love GM and GM needs our help! Tell them what you want > from them! Apparently they don’t have much of a clue of what buyers want!
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> For January > GM Down 2% > Ford Down 9% > Toyota Up 16% > Nissan Up 26% (Mostly from it’s new Titan truck > and this on top of being up 60+% > earlier!)
SNIP I just bought a new Ford Ranger a few months ago, plan to buy my wife a new Grand Am next year. Bought a new Astro van in 2000. Buy a Toyota or Nissan? HELL no.
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James ranted on: – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->For January > GM Down 2% > Ford Down 9% > Toyota Up 16% > Nissan Up 26% (Mostly from it’s new Titan truck > and this on top of being up 60+% > earlier!) >Haven’t seen the other manufacturer numbers yet. >GM execs blame the cold weather. Guess it wasn’t as cold and snowy over at >the >Nissan and Toyota dealers, huh! >The new OnStar car give-away promotion is apparently a flop…dealers report >that people come into the dealer to play the game and simply leave…few, if >any sales are resulting from the promotion, apparently. >GM has released some newly redesigned vehicles, one would think those would >bring in some buyers! Perhaps it will turn around (the continued pervasive >erosion of market share) as more of them are made available? >For those in this forum that are in the market. What will it take for you to >consider a new GM vehicle? What does GM need to do to get you to buy? What >features, design elements, functions or consumer related policies need to >change (if any do) for you to consider a new GM vehicle? >Just curious. I’ll abstain from giving my input…most of you know it >already! >:-) But, folks, we all love GM and GM needs our help! Tell them what you >want >from them! Apparently they don’t have much of a clue of what buyers want!
James, why don’t you admit that you had a problem that you could not figure out on your GM car, so you hassled GM to the point where they would not listen to you. (?) In contrast, I like my new GM just the way it is, and I would not want anybody to change the lighting control, which is what your major rant always is. Why don’t you simply take your sour grapes and go away? Please. —Bob Gross—
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Me and mine did our parts….I bought a 2004 Sierra in December; my brother got jealous and bought one himself; his stepson didn’t want to be left out and bought a Silverado. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> For January > GM Down 2% > Ford Down 9% > Toyota Up 16% > Nissan Up 26% (Mostly from it’s new Titan truck > and this on top of being up 60+% > earlier!) > Haven’t seen the other manufacturer numbers yet. > GM execs blame the cold weather. Guess it wasn’t as cold and snowy over at the > Nissan and Toyota dealers, huh! > The new OnStar car give-away promotion is apparently a flop…dealers report > that people come into the dealer to play the game and simply leave…few, if > any sales are resulting from the promotion, apparently. > GM has released some newly redesigned vehicles, one would think those would > bring in some buyers! Perhaps it will turn around (the continued pervasive > erosion of market share) as more of them are made available? > For those in this forum that are in the market. What will it take for you to > consider a new GM vehicle? What does GM need to do to get you to buy? What > features, design elements, functions or consumer related policies need to > change (if any do) for you to consider a new GM vehicle? > Just curious. I’ll abstain from giving my input…most of you know it already! > But, folks, we all love GM and GM needs our help! Tell them what you want > from them! Apparently they don’t have much of a clue of what buyers want!
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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > For January > GM Down 2% > Ford Down 9% > Toyota Up 16% > Nissan Up 26% (Mostly from it’s new Titan truck > and this on top of being up 60+% > earlier!) > Haven’t seen the other manufacturer numbers yet. > GM execs blame the cold weather. Guess it wasn’t as cold and snowy over at the > Nissan and Toyota dealers, huh! > The new OnStar car give-away promotion is apparently a flop…dealers report > that people come into the dealer to play the game and simply leave…few, if > any sales are resulting from the promotion, apparently. > GM has released some newly redesigned vehicles, one would think those would > bring in some buyers! Perhaps it will turn around (the continued pervasive > erosion of market share) as more of them are made available? > For those in this forum that are in the market. What will it take for you to > consider a new GM vehicle? What does GM need to do to get you to buy? What > features, design elements, functions or consumer related policies need to > change (if any do) for you to consider a new GM vehicle? > Just curious. I’ll abstain from giving my input…most of you know it already! > But, folks, we all love GM and GM needs our help! Tell them what you want > from them! Apparently they don’t have much of a clue of what buyers want!
Next thing to be "outsourced" I guess. If you don’t have to pay your workers a high salary so they can pay their income tax and social security plus paying their medical benefits and stuff, one can build a pretty good car at a very competitive price. Some of those foreign vehicles are assembled here in automatic factories because it is cheaper to ship the parts than it is the whole vehicle. The parts all made outside the country. Most of them use Value Added tax (Like a sales tax). They don’t tax their exports but add a big tax on anything we send them. Free trade they call it.
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>>I guess the most important thing they could do to build brand loyalty would >be to stand behind their product better. There is a KNOWN defect in the >3.4L, V-6 intake manifold gasket. This is a well known problem, yet there >has been no recall and no extended warranty.
The gasket has been redesigned in all 3.1 & 3.4 engines assembled after November 2002. Jury is still out on whether it actually fixed the problem. It does leave those who bought earlier vehicles (1999 – 2002) the possibility of a repair job down the road. I always get a GM extended warranty when I lease GM vehicles. Lots of folks say it’s a waste of money, but when the intake gasket goes just after the factory warranty would have expired, it’s paid for itself. Same deal on the 3.1L piston slap problem. Brad
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>>For those in this forum that are in the market. What will it take for you to >consider a new GM vehicle? What does GM need to do to get you to buy?
Design and build a proper station wagon. They’ve got 3 years or I get a Ford of a Mazda (same thing really) The Malibu Maxx is not a wagon in my book…it’s a sedan with an extended roof line that makes the car look like they ran out of sheetmetal during assembly.
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>>Next thing to be "outsourced" I guess.
They are already doing that. The new 2005 Chevy Equinox will be built at the CAMI plant in Ingersol, Ontario. The 3.4L engine for the Equinox will be assembled in China and shipped to Canada to reduce costs. Apparently it’s cheaper to send an engine halfway around the world then it is to build it in a somewhat close proximity to the factory.
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>>Next thing to be "outsourced" I guess. > They are already doing that. > The new 2005 Chevy Equinox will be built at the CAMI plant in Ingersol, > Ontario. The 3.4L engine for the Equinox will be assembled in China and > shipped to Canada to reduce costs. > Apparently it’s cheaper to send an engine halfway around the world then > it is to build it in a somewhat close proximity to the factory.
Isnt that wierd?
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>- Consolidate their car lines. >Cadillac – same. >Buick – pretty much the same – graft the top end Pontiacs into it. >Pontiac – Vibe, Aveo, and sporty cars. >Chevrolet would be all the SUV lines other than Cadillac. Period. >Exception – Corvette would be the one car made under the Chevrolet badge. >GMC – 100% commercial vehicles. 4500 series and up.
Where would ordinary cars go? I.e. ones that are neither especially sporty (Pontiac), nor upscale (Buick), nor luxury (Cadillac)? Seems like the Chevrolet brand could still have the ordinary cars like the Malibu, the replacement of the Cavalier, and a passenger minivan (of course, ordinary cars can and should be good cars, not just filler). Where would you do with Saturn and Saab? — Timothy J. Lee Unsolicited bulk or commercial email is not welcome. No warranty of any kind is provided with this message.
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> Where would ordinary cars go? I.e. ones that are neither especially > sporty (Pontiac), nor upscale (Buick), nor luxury (Cadillac)? Seems > like the Chevrolet brand could still have the ordinary cars like the > Malibu, the replacement of the Cavalier, and a passenger minivan (of > course, ordinary cars can and should be good cars, not just filler).
Normal cars would be split between Buick and Pontiac. When people think "Chevy" they think "Truck" and "Corvette" Pontiac – cars. Buick – upscale cars > Where would you do with Saturn and Saab?
Their own brands, of course. No change.
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> it’s a sedan with an extended roof line that makes the car look like they ran > out of sheetmetal during assembly.
AMC Gremlin for the 21st century? LOL — Dennis Smith -1971 Trans Am – 455 H.O. – M21 4speed – Cameo white/blue stripe- < http://ps2page.tripod.com/my71ta/tapage.html > -1973 Trans Am – 455 – TH400 auto – Buccaneer red- -1984 Trans Am – 5.0 L – TH700R4 auto – Royal blue/silver aero-
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>AMC Gremlin for the 21st century? LOL
Both people I know who had Gremlins had great cars, would that they were Grems for the 21st! The 72 AMC Ambassador Brougham that I had was among the best cars I’ve ever had. Nothing like a car with a queen size bed built into the front/rear lay down seats, and the 360 V8 burned rubber in all 3 gears… Wir welle bleiwe wat mir sin (Letzebuergesch)
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| James, why don’t you admit that you had a problem that you could not figure out | on your GM car, Since I earlier explained the "problem" (as you put it) quite accurately and in very fine detail, I obviously "figured it out". It wasn’t hard to figure out. I do admit that I didn’t like some of the "features" my former Malibu LS had though and expressed that the features could create confusion FOR SOME PERCENTAGE OF PEOPLE! I’ll leave it at that as to not taint this thread with "my" particular product suggestions. | so you hassled GM to the point where they would not listen | to you. (?) Two emails a hassle? Pretty low threshold, don’t you think? Obviously my suggestion struck a nerve…they must hear it A LOT. I know several people personally that have made the same suggestions I have, frankly. On file at the NHTSA are many "public comments" that have within their text claimes to have "written GM" over the same suggestion/concerns I have. Quite a common "complaint"…admit it or not! | In contrast, I like my new GM just the way it is, and I would not want anybody | to change the lighting control, which is what your major rant always is. And that is perfectly fine. I’m glad you’re fine with your car. You should have it just the way you want it…as other potential customers should as well (or they won’t buy). No need to contribute to this thread then. Most customers are probably fine with their GM car (take HarryFace, for example…a wonderful relationship with his 1991 Bonneville!). But obviously the numbers are quite clear and telling (and have been for about 6-7 years now) in that the typical average buyer is slowly going elsewhere…that is the real topic of this thread…what do members of this forum think GM needs to do to turn that around. I’ve stayed out of the discussion on "my" suggestion…that is until you made it personal and mentioned it. Do you not want some good feedback for those GM management types that lurk here to hear from loyal GM customers that care enough to post here? Tough love is the most sincere type of love…surely you must understand that! No one is going to take time here if they didn’t REALLY care! I come from many generations of GMers! Hide your head in the sand, if you must. I only hope that THAT problem you obviously have isn’t a prevasive cultural issue among the management types at GM! <sigh> | | Why don’t you simply take your sour grapes and go away? Please. Product improvement requires consumer input. Ignoring customer "gripes" (I call them product suggestions…see the difference?) is a sure way to loose business. (Oh wait, GM IS loosing business!) You aren’t the customer advocate type, are you?! ;-) You must work for GM…I’ve conversed with plenty just like you over at corporate! …a experience never had elsewhere! Go away? Not likely…sorry.
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Cool… I might just have to buy back my GM stock with this insider info! :-)
| Me and mine did our parts….I bought a 2004 Sierra in December; my brother | got jealous and bought one himself; his stepson didn’t want to be left out | and bought a Silverado. | | > For January | > | > GM Down 2% | > Ford Down 9% | > Toyota Up 16% | > Nissan Up 26% (Mostly from it’s new Titan truck | > and this on top of being up 60+% | > earlier!) | > | > Haven’t seen the other manufacturer numbers yet. | > | > GM execs blame the cold weather. Guess it wasn’t as cold and snowy over | at the | > Nissan and Toyota dealers, huh! | > | > The new OnStar car give-away promotion is apparently a flop…dealers | report | > that people come into the dealer to play the game and simply leave…few, | if | > any sales are resulting from the promotion, apparently. | > | > GM has released some newly redesigned vehicles, one would think those | would | > bring in some buyers! Perhaps it will turn around (the continued | pervasive | > erosion of market share) as more of them are made available? | > | > For those in this forum that are in the market. What will it take for you | to | > consider a new GM vehicle? What does GM need to do to get you to buy? | What | > features, design elements, functions or consumer related policies need to | > change (if any do) for you to consider a new GM vehicle? | > | > Just curious. I’ll abstain from giving my input…most of you know it | already! | > But, folks, we all love GM and GM needs our help! Tell them what you | want | > from them! Apparently they don’t have much of a clue of what buyers want! | > | > | |
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| | >>For those in this forum that are in the market. What will it take for you to | >>consider a new GM vehicle? What does GM need to do to get you to buy? | Design and build a proper station wagon. They’ve got 3 years or I get a | Ford of a Mazda (same thing really) | | The Malibu Maxx is not a wagon in my book…it’s a sedan with an | extended roof line that makes the car look like they ran out of | sheetmetal during assembly. I tend to agree. Although they seem to have made some nice improvements to the Malibu, generally (from what I’ve read, anyway). It is a little curious…wonder how much real space gain there is to the "Maxx" version over the sedan version? Hmmm…. I wonder if Dodge’s new Magnum model (coming out soon) is closer to the traditional rear-drive HEMI V8 "wagon" design or not? If so, might be worthwhile for GM to keep tabs on the Magnum sales numbers…the consumer may be interested in a "wagon" again…GM should be in that space if so…
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>>> The new 2005 Chevy Equinox will be built at the CAMI plant in Ingersol, >> Ontario. The 3.4L engine for the Equinox will be assembled in China and >> shipped to Canada to reduce costs. >> Apparently it’s cheaper to send an engine halfway around the world then >> it is to build it in a somewhat close proximity to the factory. >Isnt that wierd?
Very weird. I guess they figure that paying factory workers in China peanuts for a salary more than compensates for the shipping costs.
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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->>>The new 2005 Chevy Equinox will be built at the CAMI plant in Ingersol, >>>Ontario. The 3.4L engine for the Equinox will be assembled in China and >>>shipped to Canada to reduce costs. >>>Apparently it’s cheaper to send an engine halfway around the world then >>>it is to build it in a somewhat close proximity to the factory. >>Isnt that wierd? > Very weird. > I guess they figure that paying factory workers in China peanuts for a > salary more than compensates for the shipping costs.
And it is the only way they can compete with the other Oriental vehicles that are taking over the market. Like the textile industry, soon you will have an option of buying a car made by an oriental company or one from an American company that makes their cars in the orient.
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The US companies have for the most part continued to fall behind the power curve of competitive reality. Korea is eating up the low price market. Toyota is gaining everywhere and attacking on all fronts. Nissan is picking up the market for edgy designs and rear wheel drive performance cars. Honda has become a player in minivans, SUVS and soon pickup truck-lites. GM at least has a couple of hit products on it’s hands as well as a lot of also rans. Ford has the F150 and …. well, nothing. Chrysler is flailing about trying to figure out who and what it is while releasing funky little niche vehicles and neglecting to be a leader in any of the mainstream vehicle categories. All in all things continue to look grim for Detroit Inc. GM is probably doing the best overall job of the big 2.5, but that is not saying much. Toyota is the global car company which most thoroughly has it’s act together and they are gaining momentum by the day. John
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> Then get something like the Vibe with the large engine and manual trans. > Build quality is better than a typical GM vehicle, and it has plenty > of power. Clutch jobs are cheap as well.
Yes, Toyota can built a good Pontiac. Sad.
