4.0L engine knocking
Question:
Hello fellow Explorer owners. I have a perplexing engine problem. I’m hoping someone on this group can help. I’ll try to be brief. I have a ‘94 Explorer with the 4.0L engine. Around 50,000 miles, it began developing what sounds like valve clattering while accelerating or climbing grades. Engine now has 88,000 miles I ran the self diagnostics and got an engine trouble code which translated to "purge valve solonoid is defective." I normally do most work myself but I don’t like messing with emissions equipment so I took it to the dealer. Without any input from me (I wanted to see if their multi-thousand dollar diagnosis computer would provide any more information than the self-test) they came up with the same diagnosis. They replaced the solonoid at a cost of $140 parts & labor. Ugh. One the way home, valves began to rattle. I took it back. They spent five minutes under the hood and told me the problem was fixed. Relieved that my money was not wasted, I drove off. The engine felt heavy, mushy almost but the valve knocking was gone. 160 miles and a full tank of gas later I realized something was not right. I’m used to 20-22 mpg highway, not 10. I took it back. They disconnected a small plastic jumper from a cable behind the passenger-side headlamp. Engine ran fine but the knocking was back. I asked them what the little gray jumper did. They said it advanced the ignition timing and that I had to choose between knocking or poor fuel ecomomy. Sorry. When you buy a $27,000 vehicle, those are not acceptable alternatives. Okay, finally, here’s the question. What is going on with my ignition computer or emissions system that advancing the timing eliminates knocking but cuts my mileage in half? I use BP 89 octane fuel so junk fuel isn’t the problem. I fear that my valves are experiencing undue abuse and I’d like to get it resolved. The Ford dealers are clueless and are more interested in eliminating the symptom than solving the problem. Any ideas? Please e-mail me if you need additional info to make an educated guess. Thanks for reading. Greg Smith —
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > Hello fellow Explorer owners. I have a perplexing engine problem. I’m hoping > someone on this group can help. I’ll try to be brief. > I have a ‘94 Explorer with the 4.0L engine. Around 50,000 miles, it began > developing what sounds like valve clattering while accelerating or climbing > grades. > Any ideas? Please e-mail me if you need additional info to make an educated > guess. > Thanks for reading. > Greg Smith > —
I had knocking and pinging back a couple years ago. Took the truck into ford for an oil leak (under warranty). They replaced the intake gasket. Knocking went away. (for a while) Now its 2 years later and the knocking is back. I normally use Exxon 87 octane. A couple weeks ago I put in some Amoco 87 and it did not knock on that tank. In my case it seems to come and go. Currently I am thinking it may be related to gas. But who knows?? Mabey they all just knock when they have the mood. I do know that gas varies significantly in content. I used to test gas vapors for a living and found there was a wide variation in the content of methane in the gas. That has to have some effect. You might try just switching to some other gas (or try several) and see what happens. Dan in NC — *** comments and opinions stated are mine *** *** as such they in no way represent the *** *** policies of my employer ***
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> Hello fellow Explorer owners. I have a perplexing engine problem. I’m hoping > someone on this group can help. I’ll try to be brief. > I have a ‘94 Explorer with the 4.0L engine. Around 50,000 miles, it began > developing what sounds like valve clattering while accelerating or climbing > grades. Engine now has 88,000 miles >snip of continuing problems…<
Try disconnecting the battery for a few minutes, to let the engine management computer reset. I have heard of this helping, in problems like yours. As the Ford manual states, it will take a few miles for the computer to "relearn its idle" but it might get your timing straightened out. Chris Stoddard
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Put the grey cable back to better fuel economy w/ the rattle. Run Techroline <Chevron brand Fuel Injector Cleaner, it works better then the rest> a few times, at least twice if not three times. Also increase the octane, but that is not a mandatory. It sounds like you have carbon buildup on your fuel injectors. This takes care of the clanking problem 90% of the time. I hope this helps.
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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Okay, finally, here’s the question. What is going on with my ignition computer > or emissions system that advancing the timing eliminates knocking but cuts my > mileage in half? I use BP 89 octane fuel so junk fuel isn’t the problem. I > fear that my valves are experiencing undue abuse and I’d like to get it > resolved. The Ford dealers are clueless and are more interested in eliminating > the symptom than solving the problem. > Any ideas? Please e-mail me if you need additional info to make an educated > guess. > Thanks for reading. > Greg Smith > —
I had the same problem with my 93 Explorer… Do not remove the "Octane Shorting Bar"….this is a lame solution at best and will ruin your fuel economy. I tried several things till my neighbor, a Ford Field Engineer explained to me that the 4.0 litre engine have a tendency to build up carbon in the cylinders over a period of time and this will cause pre-ignition. It seems to be more prevelent when the engine has warmed up or hot. His solution (Ford’s), was: 1. Buy a can of Ford’s Tune-Up Carburetor Cleaner (1-Pint) Their P/N D9AZ-19579-BA… 2. Get about a two foot section of vaccume hose… 3. On the drivers side of the intake manifold, there is an octupus vaccume junction. There should be a free connector with only a cap on it.. 4. Remove the cap…the engine might increase in idle…its ok… 5. Stick the two foot extesion hose over the connector. 6. Open the can of Tune-Up Carburetor Cleaner… 7. Now…ONLY DO THIS IN A OPEN AREA…NOT IN THE GARAGE !!!!! 8. Stick the vaccume hose into the open can of cleaner…It will suck it down FAST… 9. The Engine will start to sputter an/or even die…Go For It… 10. If the engine keeps going, then the exhaust will start to smoke and STINK BAD !!! You will swear that the truck is on fire… This is normal…keep going….Till all the cleaner is used… 11. Head on down the road…This works best if your are going to drive at high speeds for a duration. Summation: I found that it took about two cans of this stuff with a tank of gas between each can to totally fix it…Pings are gone and I’m back to 87 octane gas….Good fix from Ford…and really cheap if your do it yourself… Total expense: Slightly over $10.00…. I now keep a can around in the garage with the hose wrapped around it… Haven’t needed it yet…Don’t expect to for awhile… Good Luck to all… -Tim
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > His solution (Ford’s), was: > 1. Buy a can of Ford’s Tune-Up Carburetor Cleaner (1-Pint) > Their P/N D9AZ-19579-BA… > 2. Get about a two foot section of vaccume hose… > 3. On the drivers side of the intake manifold, there is an octupus > vaccume junction. There should be a free connector with only a cap > on it.. > 4. Remove the cap…the engine might increase in idle…its ok… > 5. Stick the two foot extesion hose over the connector. > 6. Open the can of Tune-Up Carburetor Cleaner… > 7. Now…ONLY DO THIS IN A OPEN AREA…NOT IN THE GARAGE !!!!! > 8. Stick the vaccume hose into the open can of cleaner…It will > suck it down FAST… > 9. The Engine will start to sputter an/or even die…Go For It… > 10. If the engine keeps going, then the exhaust will start to smoke > and STINK BAD !!! You will swear that the truck is on fire… > This is normal…keep going….Till all the cleaner is used… > 11. Head on down the road…This works best if your are going to drive > at high speeds for a duration.
Hello! This procedure does get the carbon out, but it may have an unintended side-effect. The dealer performed this on my 97 Explorer SOHC. Afterwards, I took apart the intake fron the throttle body to the air box. It was completely fouled with the cleaning fluid. I had to wipe everything down and replace the air filter – it was soaked. This is especially bad for the throttle body, which has a special lubricant on the bore and should not be cleaned or exposed to cleaners. I informed the dealer about the problem. They had never seen this problem, but then again, I dont know how often they take apart the intake after performing the procedure. Just something to watch out for… John
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Your idea seems to be the consensus…carbon buildup. I’ll give it a try. Thanks for your reply to my posting. —
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I recently had a battery die so dead that the radio lost its preset station memory. I would think that my computer would have bottomed out the same. Do I need to leave the battery disconnected longer to allow capacitive memory to die also? —
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I had the same problem. After many hours on this newsgroup and under the hood of my ‘92 EB here is what I found – The #5 Cylinder was burning way hotter than the other 5. The engine needs a new intake manifold gasket and to be cleaned out with a good engine cleaner. There is a Ford TSB which addresses this problem but for the symptom of coolant loss, not knocking. If your problem is accompanied by light oil usage (1 qt per 4-5K miles), I would bet that this is your problem. What did I do? Well, after 5 months of tolerating total lunacy from Ford and the used car dealer, I traded the explorer EB back for a ‘93 GMC Jimmy. When you have a problem that is under warranty, and you tell the dealer what is wrong and how to fix it, and you leave the car for service 3 times, and the stupid idiots still can’t fix the problem, it’s time to move on. Regards and Good Luck with the fix! (you’ll need it!)
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Greg – When I disconnected my battery, I waited 1/2 hour to allow for full discharge. I also touched the 2 cables together after 15 minutes. I got a nice spark when I re-connected . . . that was about it. If it is carbon build up, you will see some oil consumption as I mentioned in my last post/e-mail. My "hot" cylinder (#5) had heat and carbon problems evident by simply looking at the spark plugs.
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>> Hello fellow Explorer owners. I have a perplexing engine problem. I’m hoping > someone on this group can help. I’ll try to be brief.
[deletia] I had a similar problem deveoped at about 70,000 miles on my ‘92. My local dealer told me there is a ping sensor that can go bad and that they’ve had good luck by just unplugging the things. I took mine in for service and the knocking has been greatly reduced . I’m not really sure how the the ping sensor works (or if it really exists for that matter) but the pinging problem stopped for me and Ford didn’t charge me anything to disconnect the "device". ..Chris..
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Chris: No knock or ping sensor on your ‘92. Ask the dealer to show you where it is– I’d like to know too! The Ford dealer’s "cure" was probably to remove the "octane shorting block", thus retarding the ignition timing by 3 degrees. If you are at all comfortable in the engine compartment you can see if that’s what they did. On the right side fenderwell (passengers side is ‘right’), locate the fuse box. Going out the bottom rear of this box is a wiring bundle maybe 1" or so in diameter. About eight inches or so out of the fuse box, two wires break out of the bundle. These are maybe 4" long, and have a small socket on the end, about 1.25 wide and .5 or so thick. There is a plug in there, grey, called the "octane shorting block." Is it in there? If the socket is empty, dash back to the dealer and get your plug back. Removing the plug does eliminate the pinging, but at significant expense to you. Your engine doesn’t run as well, makes less power. So you end up pushing harder on the loud pedal when you drive. This means a bunch more fuel is used, even beyond what’s consumed making up for the timing loss. Removing this plug is the –LAST— resort, after all other methods have failed. Unfortunately it is the easiest (and cheapest to the dealer) solution and is often tried first. There have been numerous threads on pinging over the last year or so. Do a quick search in DejaNews (www.dejanews.com) for articles in the newsgroup here regarding pinging. You’ll find suggestions that will probably help you without beating you to death at the pump. dr bob Good Luck! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->> Hello fellow Explorer owners. I have a perplexing engine problem. I’m hoping >> someone on this group can help. I’ll try to be brief. >[deletia] >I had a similar problem deveoped at about 70,000 miles on my ‘92. >My local dealer told me there is a ping sensor that can go bad and >that they’ve had good luck by just unplugging the things. I took mine >in for service and the knocking has been greatly reduced . I’m not >really sure how the the ping sensor works (or if it really exists for >that matter) but the pinging problem stopped for me and Ford didn’t >charge me anything to disconnect the "device". ..Chris..
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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->> Hello fellow Explorer owners. I have a perplexing engine problem. I’m hoping >> someone on this group can help. I’ll try to be brief. > [deletia] > I had a similar problem deveoped at about 70,000 miles on my ‘92. > My local dealer told me there is a ping sensor that can go bad and > that they’ve had good luck by just unplugging the things. I took mine > in for service and the knocking has been greatly reduced . I’m not > really sure how the the ping sensor works (or if it really exists for > that matter) but the pinging problem stopped for me and Ford didn’t > charge me anything to disconnect the "device". ..Chris..
I have a ‘92, and there is no ping or knock detector. What there is, is a plug in the wiring harness that, when removed, retards the timing by about three degrees. Usually, removing that plug will reduce any knocking or pinging. On our Explorer, replacing the intake manifold (there was a slight leak near #5) removed the knock altogether. I don’t know if this is a chronic problem, but the fix worked for us. Bill Funk
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Check your air charge sensor!! Located on intake manifold!
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What do you check it for? How? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Check your air charge sensor!! Located on intake manifold!
