New Info About Bad Paint!
Question:
> Hello Everyone, > Here is some more bad paint information.
[huge snip] > If that’s the kind of intelligence the average upper-level management > GM employee has, it’s no wonder you can’t make vehicles where the > paint will stay on. > Good job, GM. Talk about shooting yourself in the foot.
Maybe GM’s upper management was asleep during the Intel Pentium Floating Point fiasco… Seems like many other companies learned a lesson there… The only thing worse than an unfavorable feature on the national news is the truth on the ‘net. — — Eric ++ Treasurer: Saturn CarClub of Rochester Treasurer: Saturn CarClub of Western NY Moonlighting as a Systems Programmer 
For Sale: 94 SC2m Aq/Bk AC CC ABS AU++++ /w CD Changer (was AU++) SW, 29k mi. Excellent condition. Factory Warrenty thru 12/96. Call 716-272-8400 x476 … must sell: my new ‘97 SC2 is waiting patiently for me to pick her up
Response:
Hello Everyone, Here is some more bad paint information. I still need pictures for the Web Page, and I still would appreciate any and all comments, questions, etc. Please have a look at: http://www.mindspring.com/~tracey/gmpaint.html for more information. I’d advise everyone even thinking about buying a new GM (or any) car or truck to have a look at the page. It will make you think twice. Enjoy! More GM Paint Information: I was given this information by a couple of people very close to the problem of peeling paint with regards to GM cars. I have not been able to verify this information, or the exact positions of the people who gave it to me, but I thought I would paraphrase it and pass it on anyway. Take it with a grain of salt. Supposedly, GM has spent an average of 3 hours worth of training on customer service representative, dealing specifically with paint problems. They also have been rumored to handout a 30 page training guide with regards to paint problems of all types. (Anyone have any idea or chance of getting one of these babies?) Representatives are supposedly instructed to tell people ‘There have been no recalls regarding paint problems with your vehicle’ when they are question about it. This I can confirm, (sort of) because it was the first response I received when I called GM when my paint first started peeling of my back bumper. Notice how they are not denying the problem, and not lying outright, but just saying "No recalls", which is true. More manufacturing sneaky, deceptive bullshit. The kind we can expect from GM. The problem has to do with a certain supplier (I won’t mention the name I heard here because I have no concrete proof) telling the car manufacturers that their new paint they developed doesn’t need a certain preparation step before painting. The result for the manufacturer’s is that they save money, and we all know what the result is for us. The problem did start in 1984. I already knew this however, by the fact that I own a 1985 GMC truck with this problem also. The cars usually take a few years to start peeling. The reason they peel? Supposedly it has to do with the amount of direct sunlight and UV rays the car receives. This is why the top half of the cars exhibit the most peeling, what one source called "above the beltline". No one knows when the problems will completely stop. A few people have speculated that when all of the models are changed over into new designs, the factories will be revamped to add the old ‘pre-paint prep step’ back into the production line. According to my sources, there are some models out there that have a ‘real good’ chance of peeling through the 1996 year. Again, I can’t verify this information, and it will be a cold day in hell before I purchase another GM vehicle to find out. I was told that it is ‘too expensive’ to fix the lines at this point in time. The GM divisions operate individually, and are in competition with each other (sort of). This means that Cheverolet doesn’t know what Pontiac is doing, and vice versa. (Which, in reality I find real real hard to believe.) I do not know at this point in time if all GM divisions were told to follow the same procedures, or if some of them are making it up as they go along. For the record, I spoke to three different divisions, giving them the year and mileage of a particular car (changing only the model name) and two told me to bring the car to the dealer, one told me screw off’ Buick seems to want to be the most helpful, Pontiac, the LEAST helpful. In fact, it seems like Pontiac will not admit to any problems at all with their paint, and when I questioned them about it, they even told me (at first) that they were unaware of ANY paint issues with any of their vehicles. Yeah, right. A particular dealer even said the exact same thing about Pontiac to one of our ‘bad paint regulars’ when they took their car in to be painted. Guess some dealerships aren’t that loyal, eh? Anyway, another ‘fun to know but unconfirmed fact’ is that it supposedly cost GM 1.6 billion dollars to repaint all those cars in the first 18 months that the TSB was released, and this why they tried to cut the goodwill period from six years to five years. Also, take note. The information from the Web Page and some ‘pictures’ were passed to a dealership or two within the last week. GM *is probably* aware of the outrage of everyone on the net by now, but instead of being ‘a responsible corporation’ is choosing to run and hide, clinging to mommy’s leg. More typical GM action. So, if any GM employees are reading this, and I’m pretty sure that you are, be aware that by not painting my car, and the cars of people who are involved with the web pages, gathering TSB’s and posting publicly about this problem, have probably cost you more money in lost sales then if you painted all of our cars. If that’s the kind of intelligence the average upper-level management GM employee has, it’s no wonder you can’t make vehicles where the paint will stay on. Good job, GM. Talk about shooting yourself in the foot. By the way, I’ll have another set of pictures up on the Web in a few days. Something for all you Suburban / GMC Truck owners to look at. Get a good look, and keep the image in the back of your mind when it is time to buy a new car. Did you know that GM cars have paint problems? Yup! It’s true! Get the ‘GM BAD PAINT FAQ’! Point your browser to: http://www.mindspring.com/~tracey/gmpaint.html
Response:
> Hello Everyone, > Here is some more bad paint information.
[huge snip] > If that’s the kind of intelligence the average upper-level management > GM employee has, it’s no wonder you can’t make vehicles where the > paint will stay on. > Good job, GM. Talk about shooting yourself in the foot.
Maybe GM’s upper management was asleep during the Intel Pentium Floating Point fiasco… Seems like many other companies learned a lesson there… The only thing worse than an unfavorable feature on the national news is the truth on the ‘net. — — Eric ++ Treasurer: Saturn CarClub of Rochester Treasurer: Saturn CarClub of Western NY Moonlighting as a Systems Programmer For Sale: 94 SC2m Aq/Bk AC CC ABS AU++++ /w CD Changer (was AU++) SW, 29k mi. Excellent condition. Factory Warrenty thru 12/96. Call 716-272-8400 x476 … must sell: my new ‘97 SC2 is waiting patiently for me to pick her up
Response:
Hello Everyone, Here is some more bad paint information. I still need pictures for the Web Page, and I still would appreciate any and all comments, questions, etc. Please have a look at: http://www.mindspring.com/~tracey/gmpaint.html for more information. I’d advise everyone even thinking about buying a new GM (or any) car or truck to have a look at the page. It will make you think twice. Enjoy! More GM Paint Information: I was given this information by a couple of people very close to the problem of peeling paint with regards to GM cars. I have not been able to verify this information, or the exact positions of the people who gave it to me, but I thought I would paraphrase it and pass it on anyway. Take it with a grain of salt. Supposedly, GM has spent an average of 3 hours worth of training on customer service representative, dealing specifically with paint problems. They also have been rumored to handout a 30 page training guide with regards to paint problems of all types. (Anyone have any idea or chance of getting one of these babies?) Representatives are supposedly instructed to tell people ‘There have been no recalls regarding paint problems with your vehicle’ when they are question about it. This I can confirm, (sort of) because it was the first response I received when I called GM when my paint first started peeling of my back bumper. Notice how they are not denying the problem, and not lying outright, but just saying "No recalls", which is true. More manufacturing sneaky, deceptive bullshit. The kind we can expect from GM. The problem has to do with a certain supplier (I won’t mention the name I heard here because I have no concrete proof) telling the car manufacturers that their new paint they developed doesn’t need a certain preparation step before painting. The result for the manufacturer’s is that they save money, and we all know what the result is for us. The problem did start in 1984. I already knew this however, by the fact that I own a 1985 GMC truck with this problem also. The cars usually take a few years to start peeling. The reason they peel? Supposedly it has to do with the amount of direct sunlight and UV rays the car receives. This is why the top half of the cars exhibit the most peeling, what one source called "above the beltline". No one knows when the problems will completely stop. A few people have speculated that when all of the models are changed over into new designs, the factories will be revamped to add the old ‘pre-paint prep step’ back into the production line. According to my sources, there are some models out there that have a ‘real good’ chance of peeling through the 1996 year. Again, I can’t verify this information, and it will be a cold day in hell before I purchase another GM vehicle to find out. I was told that it is ‘too expensive’ to fix the lines at this point in time. The GM divisions operate individually, and are in competition with each other (sort of). This means that Cheverolet doesn’t know what Pontiac is doing, and vice versa. (Which, in reality I find real real hard to believe.) I do not know at this point in time if all GM divisions were told to follow the same procedures, or if some of them are making it up as they go along. For the record, I spoke to three different divisions, giving them the year and mileage of a particular car (changing only the model name) and two told me to bring the car to the dealer, one told me screw off’ Buick seems to want to be the most helpful, Pontiac, the LEAST helpful. In fact, it seems like Pontiac will not admit to any problems at all with their paint, and when I questioned them about it, they even told me (at first) that they were unaware of ANY paint issues with any of their vehicles. Yeah, right. A particular dealer even said the exact same thing about Pontiac to one of our ‘bad paint regulars’ when they took their car in to be painted. Guess some dealerships aren’t that loyal, eh? Anyway, another ‘fun to know but unconfirmed fact’ is that it supposedly cost GM 1.6 billion dollars to repaint all those cars in the first 18 months that the TSB was released, and this why they tried to cut the goodwill period from six years to five years. Also, take note. The information from the Web Page and some ‘pictures’ were passed to a dealership or two within the last week. GM *is probably* aware of the outrage of everyone on the net by now, but instead of being ‘a responsible corporation’ is choosing to run and hide, clinging to mommy’s leg. More typical GM action. So, if any GM employees are reading this, and I’m pretty sure that you are, be aware that by not painting my car, and the cars of people who are involved with the web pages, gathering TSB’s and posting publicly about this problem, have probably cost you more money in lost sales then if you painted all of our cars. If that’s the kind of intelligence the average upper-level management GM employee has, it’s no wonder you can’t make vehicles where the paint will stay on. Good job, GM. Talk about shooting yourself in the foot. By the way, I’ll have another set of pictures up on the Web in a few days. Something for all you Suburban / GMC Truck owners to look at. Get a good look, and keep the image in the back of your mind when it is time to buy a new car. Did you know that GM cars have paint problems? Yup! It’s true! Get the ‘GM BAD PAINT FAQ’! Point your browser to: http://www.mindspring.com/~tracey/gmpaint.html
